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	<title>Comments on: Further Commentary on Chip-and-PIN Challenges for US Travelers, Issuers, and Card Networks</title>
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	<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/</link>
	<description>Views and Opinions about the World of Payments</description>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-4604</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Nov 2009 17:48:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-4604</guid>
		<description>I spent two weeks in the UK in September 2009 and had no problems with either my Mastercard (Capital One) or my Amex.  Occasionally, a waiter would say, &quot;Oh, that&#039;s one of those.  You&#039;ll have to sign.&quot;  I spent several  days in London and then in remote parts of Yorkshire with no problems in either area.  I will be in Paris later this month --- I have been told that the French (quelle surprise) are less amenable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I spent two weeks in the UK in September 2009 and had no problems with either my Mastercard (Capital One) or my Amex.  Occasionally, a waiter would say, &#8220;Oh, that&#8217;s one of those.  You&#8217;ll have to sign.&#8221;  I spent several  days in London and then in remote parts of Yorkshire with no problems in either area.  I will be in Paris later this month &#8212; I have been told that the French (quelle surprise) are less amenable.</p>
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		<title>By: Marite Ferrero</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-4288</link>
		<dc:creator>Marite Ferrero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 11:21:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-4288</guid>
		<description>I have also a noticed a difference in card usage habits. In the U.S., it&#039;s not unheard of to charge a $1.00 purchase. 

In europe, most vendors just would not accept a card, regardless of whether it has a chip or mag-stripe, as long as it&#039;s not over a certain amount that they deem is acceptable for them. Of course, this, americans would not know. Most times, when the vendor deems the amount to small, he/she pretends not to be able to take the card saying that their machine does not work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have also a noticed a difference in card usage habits. In the U.S., it&#8217;s not unheard of to charge a $1.00 purchase. </p>
<p>In europe, most vendors just would not accept a card, regardless of whether it has a chip or mag-stripe, as long as it&#8217;s not over a certain amount that they deem is acceptable for them. Of course, this, americans would not know. Most times, when the vendor deems the amount to small, he/she pretends not to be able to take the card saying that their machine does not work.</p>
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		<title>By: Marite Ferrero</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-4287</link>
		<dc:creator>Marite Ferrero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 11:16:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-4287</guid>
		<description>&quot;I can honestly state that the US lags far behind the rest of the world in terms of credit-card usage (let alone technology).&quot;

Sorry, credit card usage in the US is still higher than in any other country. Actually, that&#039;s also what contributed to this financial crisis. I just wanted to correct you on this. 

&quot;Why the US is so retentive about CnP is beyond me.&quot; 

The answer to this is that there is no business case in the U.S. to move to chip and pin. As I stated above, &quot;Card Fraud in the U.S. = 0.057% of transactions, by value. According to APACS, for UK : “fraudulent transactions make up 0.12% of all transactions, by value”.  

&quot;US-based system is wasteful. After we sign 1-2 pieces of paper and processing is complete, what happens to the paper? Yep, into the trash or shredded.&quot;

When I use my chip and pin here in France, I do notice that 2 slips are printed. One for me and one for the vendor. There&#039;s no difference. So, what is wasteful?

&quot;As far as I’m concerned, we Americans are getting our butts kicked, and I can say this from immersing myself into the overseas society and communities.&quot;

May I suggest that you follow the C and P issue in the U.S. before arriving to such a conclusion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I can honestly state that the US lags far behind the rest of the world in terms of credit-card usage (let alone technology).&#8221;</p>
<p>Sorry, credit card usage in the US is still higher than in any other country. Actually, that&#8217;s also what contributed to this financial crisis. I just wanted to correct you on this. </p>
<p>&#8220;Why the US is so retentive about CnP is beyond me.&#8221; </p>
<p>The answer to this is that there is no business case in the U.S. to move to chip and pin. As I stated above, &#8220;Card Fraud in the U.S. = 0.057% of transactions, by value. According to APACS, for UK : “fraudulent transactions make up 0.12% of all transactions, by value”.  </p>
<p>&#8220;US-based system is wasteful. After we sign 1-2 pieces of paper and processing is complete, what happens to the paper? Yep, into the trash or shredded.&#8221;</p>
<p>When I use my chip and pin here in France, I do notice that 2 slips are printed. One for me and one for the vendor. There&#8217;s no difference. So, what is wasteful?</p>
<p>&#8220;As far as I’m concerned, we Americans are getting our butts kicked, and I can say this from immersing myself into the overseas society and communities.&#8221;</p>
<p>May I suggest that you follow the C and P issue in the U.S. before arriving to such a conclusion.</p>
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		<title>By: Marite Ferrero</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-4286</link>
		<dc:creator>Marite Ferrero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 11:06:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-4286</guid>
		<description>As an american living in France, I can report to you that Electron VISA cards issued in Europe, with chip and pin, are also refused in most gasoline unattended terminals and other unattended terminals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an american living in France, I can report to you that Electron VISA cards issued in Europe, with chip and pin, are also refused in most gasoline unattended terminals and other unattended terminals.</p>
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		<title>By: foleydog</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-3969</link>
		<dc:creator>foleydog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 17:40:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-3969</guid>
		<description>I just came back from the UK a few days ago.  And after three weeks, I can safely say this is a huge issue.  There were two B&amp;Bs that weren&#039;t equipped to take swipe cards.  Additionally, the last B&amp;B owner told me that when her swipe terminal became obsolete, her merchant bank informed her they would only replace it with one that accepted chip and pin.  My solution over the last two years in Portugal, the Netherlands, France, and the UK has been to carry more cash.  Ironically, banks have pushed themselves to the bottom of the line for these kinds of transactions.  And while most Americans don&#039;t travel abroad often - there has to be a significant market for them to forego - no?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just came back from the UK a few days ago.  And after three weeks, I can safely say this is a huge issue.  There were two B&amp;Bs that weren&#8217;t equipped to take swipe cards.  Additionally, the last B&amp;B owner told me that when her swipe terminal became obsolete, her merchant bank informed her they would only replace it with one that accepted chip and pin.  My solution over the last two years in Portugal, the Netherlands, France, and the UK has been to carry more cash.  Ironically, banks have pushed themselves to the bottom of the line for these kinds of transactions.  And while most Americans don&#8217;t travel abroad often &#8211; there has to be a significant market for them to forego &#8211; no?</p>
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		<title>By: Dennis</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-3819</link>
		<dc:creator>Dennis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Aug 2009 21:11:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-3819</guid>
		<description>This is all fine and dandy, but what does an American have as an option when traveling to Europe? As others mentioned, there are times when speaking to a manger is not a viable solution - especially if you don&#039;t speak his/her language. Also, many of the kiosks in train/metro stations only take the chipped cards. It would be so much more convenient to have one of these at least for traveling.

I&#039;ve looked far and wide for a solution to getting at least a temp Chip and Pin card for my travels, to no avail. Can anyone offer up any new leads on this? None of the international banks I&#039;ve tried want to offer up CaP cards to their American customers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is all fine and dandy, but what does an American have as an option when traveling to Europe? As others mentioned, there are times when speaking to a manger is not a viable solution &#8211; especially if you don&#8217;t speak his/her language. Also, many of the kiosks in train/metro stations only take the chipped cards. It would be so much more convenient to have one of these at least for traveling.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve looked far and wide for a solution to getting at least a temp Chip and Pin card for my travels, to no avail. Can anyone offer up any new leads on this? None of the international banks I&#8217;ve tried want to offer up CaP cards to their American customers.</p>
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		<title>By: Marite Ferrero</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-3795</link>
		<dc:creator>Marite Ferrero</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Aug 2009 10:58:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-3795</guid>
		<description>Need to correct you there, Cosmo Larkin. 

ATMs in Europe (yes, also the EMV compliant), always check that there is a valid magnetic stripe prior to even processing a chip and pin card. If you are in Europe and you have a chip and pin, try zapping your mag-stripe and you will be surprised that you will no longer be able to withdraw money with your chip and pin card.

Signature-based card transactions, arcane as you describe them actually results to less fraud than chip and static pin-code. The weakness in the chip and pin, of course is the static pin-code.  I&#039;ve always suggested changing the static pin-code to one-time use pin-codes.

Magstripe issued only upon request? How inconvenient for consumers. Also issuance of another card is an added expense for card issuers. And what good would this do? Hypothetically, once the mag-stripe card is issued and used outside of Europe, then this card would be as susceptible as American mag-stripe cards used in Europe.

European banks can consider issuing &quot;national-only&quot; or &quot;european-only&quot; cards. Afterall, wouldn&#039;t getting rid of the magnetic stripe equate to the same thing? But why aren&#039;t they doing this? In the past, French banks issued &#039;national&#039; cards but stopped issuing them since a majority of french cardholders preferred international cards, although they paid more for int&#039;l cards and although 65%+ of french cardholders never travel out of france within a 12 month period. One other drawback to this is that european banks will have to consider lowering their card fees for such limited-use cards.

Therefore, why not consider a system that enables the cardholder to turn on and turn off his card account? With such a system, the cardholder can turn off his card account against any &#039;foreign&#039; transaction while he is in his home country and turn it on before travelling. With such a system, the cardholder can also turn off his card account against any &#039;internet&#039; transaction and turn it on before doing an online card payment. This patented system has been in existence since 2000. I do think that if consumers find out that such a system exists, that they might just ask their banks to implement and offer it. It&#039;s particularly useful to cardholders for their debit and prepaid cards. There is a different mindset for credit cards, as the money lost belong to the banks and not the consumers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Need to correct you there, Cosmo Larkin. </p>
<p>ATMs in Europe (yes, also the EMV compliant), always check that there is a valid magnetic stripe prior to even processing a chip and pin card. If you are in Europe and you have a chip and pin, try zapping your mag-stripe and you will be surprised that you will no longer be able to withdraw money with your chip and pin card.</p>
<p>Signature-based card transactions, arcane as you describe them actually results to less fraud than chip and static pin-code. The weakness in the chip and pin, of course is the static pin-code.  I&#8217;ve always suggested changing the static pin-code to one-time use pin-codes.</p>
<p>Magstripe issued only upon request? How inconvenient for consumers. Also issuance of another card is an added expense for card issuers. And what good would this do? Hypothetically, once the mag-stripe card is issued and used outside of Europe, then this card would be as susceptible as American mag-stripe cards used in Europe.</p>
<p>European banks can consider issuing &#8220;national-only&#8221; or &#8220;european-only&#8221; cards. Afterall, wouldn&#8217;t getting rid of the magnetic stripe equate to the same thing? But why aren&#8217;t they doing this? In the past, French banks issued &#8216;national&#8217; cards but stopped issuing them since a majority of french cardholders preferred international cards, although they paid more for int&#8217;l cards and although 65%+ of french cardholders never travel out of france within a 12 month period. One other drawback to this is that european banks will have to consider lowering their card fees for such limited-use cards.</p>
<p>Therefore, why not consider a system that enables the cardholder to turn on and turn off his card account? With such a system, the cardholder can turn off his card account against any &#8216;foreign&#8217; transaction while he is in his home country and turn it on before travelling. With such a system, the cardholder can also turn off his card account against any &#8216;internet&#8217; transaction and turn it on before doing an online card payment. This patented system has been in existence since 2000. I do think that if consumers find out that such a system exists, that they might just ask their banks to implement and offer it. It&#8217;s particularly useful to cardholders for their debit and prepaid cards. There is a different mindset for credit cards, as the money lost belong to the banks and not the consumers.</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Marler</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-3784</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Marler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Aug 2009 00:30:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-3784</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the follow-up!  I&#039;m a bit disappointed to hear that the contact-less cards won&#039;t be accepted either though.

I have to agree with other commenters as well.  Regardless of what is possible, or &quot;should happen&quot; the reality is often such that many merchants just won&#039;t take mag-stripe cards.  I typically just use cash, or avoid smaller shops that don&#039;t typically cater to tourists and travelers.  I never have any problems on high street.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the follow-up!  I&#8217;m a bit disappointed to hear that the contact-less cards won&#8217;t be accepted either though.</p>
<p>I have to agree with other commenters as well.  Regardless of what is possible, or &#8220;should happen&#8221; the reality is often such that many merchants just won&#8217;t take mag-stripe cards.  I typically just use cash, or avoid smaller shops that don&#8217;t typically cater to tourists and travelers.  I never have any problems on high street.</p>
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		<title>By: EPK</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-3775</link>
		<dc:creator>EPK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Aug 2009 18:34:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-3775</guid>
		<description>Prior to the early-2000s, I would&#039;ve stated the US ruled in regards to credit-cards.  Living and working in the UK for quite a few years, though, I can honestly state that the US lags far behind the rest of the world in terms of credit-card usage (let alone technology).  My UK CC and Debit card were both chip-n-pin.  Best thing I&#039;ve found since sliced bread.  Of course, I still used my US-based Amex but VS &amp; MC weren&#039;t accepted much at all.  For my AX CC, not many problems with vendors even though I had to sign.   Across the UK and most of Europe, the One-Card was chip-n-pin based.  Why the US is so retentive about CnP is beyond me.  

We&#039;re just talking about one aspect, though.  Take into account other areas, e.g., the Going Green initiatives.  CnP is simple, protective, fast, and non-polluting.  US-based system is wasteful.  After we sign 1-2 pieces of paper and processing is complete, what happens to the paper?  Yep, into the trash or shredded.  Physical trash that individuals don&#039;t care about, however, on a large-scale, builds-up.  Across the pond, the countries have their act together as far as paperless goes, especially with CCs.

As far as I&#039;m concerned, we Americans are getting our butts kicked, and I can say this from immersing myself into the overseas society and communities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prior to the early-2000s, I would&#8217;ve stated the US ruled in regards to credit-cards.  Living and working in the UK for quite a few years, though, I can honestly state that the US lags far behind the rest of the world in terms of credit-card usage (let alone technology).  My UK CC and Debit card were both chip-n-pin.  Best thing I&#8217;ve found since sliced bread.  Of course, I still used my US-based Amex but VS &amp; MC weren&#8217;t accepted much at all.  For my AX CC, not many problems with vendors even though I had to sign.   Across the UK and most of Europe, the One-Card was chip-n-pin based.  Why the US is so retentive about CnP is beyond me.  </p>
<p>We&#8217;re just talking about one aspect, though.  Take into account other areas, e.g., the Going Green initiatives.  CnP is simple, protective, fast, and non-polluting.  US-based system is wasteful.  After we sign 1-2 pieces of paper and processing is complete, what happens to the paper?  Yep, into the trash or shredded.  Physical trash that individuals don&#8217;t care about, however, on a large-scale, builds-up.  Across the pond, the countries have their act together as far as paperless goes, especially with CCs.</p>
<p>As far as I&#8217;m concerned, we Americans are getting our butts kicked, and I can say this from immersing myself into the overseas society and communities.</p>
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		<title>By: Cosmo Larkin</title>
		<link>http://paymentsviews.com/2009/08/13/further-commentary-chip-and-pin-challenges-for-us-travelers-issuers-and-card-networks/comment-page-1/#comment-3773</link>
		<dc:creator>Cosmo Larkin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Aug 2009 10:50:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://paymentsviews.com/?p=2309#comment-3773</guid>
		<description>&gt; How would european cardholders be able to use their cards in the US for example if cards are without the mag-stripe? Even ATM machines in Europe require the mag-stripe!

Firstly the majority of European cardholders only use their cards in Europe. So 90% or so of cards can be issued without magstripe. Magstripe cards would be issued only on request for those that travel to countries still using this arcane technology.

Many ATMs in Europe have been converted to Chip and all will have been converted by the time the EPC mandate comes into effect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt; How would european cardholders be able to use their cards in the US for example if cards are without the mag-stripe? Even ATM machines in Europe require the mag-stripe!</p>
<p>Firstly the majority of European cardholders only use their cards in Europe. So 90% or so of cards can be issued without magstripe. Magstripe cards would be issued only on request for those that travel to countries still using this arcane technology.</p>
<p>Many ATMs in Europe have been converted to Chip and all will have been converted by the time the EPC mandate comes into effect.</p>
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